Why do people deny climate change and our part in it?
The entire scientific community, from climate scientists to geologists to oceanographers are all in complete agreement: The climate is changing significantly, and it is as a direct result of human action.
So why do you disagree, anon? Why does anyone disagree?
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All through the 70s and 80s they said it was global cooling and we were in for a new ice age in the next 20 years.
Then in the 90s and 2000s it was global warming and the planet was going to die in 10 years
Now it's just "climate change" and all of the "the planet will be destroyed in 5, no wait 10 years" predictions have come and gone.
The reason no one takes your doomsday predictions seriously is because they keep not coming true.
i don't deny climate change i just deny the validity of libshits' "solutions" to climate change
if you watch that michael fatmoore docu on green politics that's basically my position - climate change is inherent to industrial societies and technological solutions not only don't help but actively make things worse
>The entire scientific community, from climate scientists to geologists to oceanographers are all in complete agreement
That's simply untrue.
I agree anon, but governments aren't willing to do what's necessary
if people really took climate change seriously they would advocate for an all out nuclear first strike against China and India. This needs to happen TODAY. Present predictions have the planet completely uninhabitable to all life within a generation, if we can reduce the Earth's population by several billion and wipe out the worst polluters, at least our kids might be able to live in self contained habs underground. Yes I know it's "pulling up the drawbridge" after the west has already become industrialized, but at least some life *might* survive.
>climate change bad we need to reduce our carbon footprint and have less kids
>our populations are decreasing, we need to import millions of shitskins!
>boarders are racist! no human is illegal
>ukraine and isreal are being invaded, we need to create weapons and bomb the shit out of russia and palestine which is good for the enviornment!
What do you want me to do about it besides recycling not littering small gardening and just average shit?
I don't care, I have aircon.
Problem is that information is used in malicious way, so it is better to deny it.
We are still coming out of the Little Ice Age. Obviously the climate will warm up over time. I am less concerned with climate change and more concerned with POPs and microplastics in the water tbh.
I'll start taking anthropogenic climate change seriously when the ultra-wealthy stop using private jets, bring industry back to North America, and start putting more pressure on India/China to reduce emissions/pollution.
>Little Ice Age
Never happened.
>I'll start taking anthropogenic climate change seriously when the ultra-wealthy stop using private jets, bring industry back to North America, and start putting more pressure on India/China to reduce emissions/pollution.
These things DO NOT affecting climate like the horrific and terrible pollution producing by us american and our billions car constant running
>esl
>'us american'
Pretty fitting.
Yes, they do.
>PER CAPITA DOE!
Most of china basically lives in the late iron age and shows us what life would be like if PER CAPITA DOE pollution were lowered in the west.
The population in the west is shrinking. Birth rates are below replacement. The ONLY thing anyone needs to do over here, is let this continue without importing religitard immigrants who think the birth rate should go up because god said so. Population = pollution. But no longer trading with china would help the world a ton. Chinese greed can only exist because of american laziness. Not excusing either of them, but someone has to break the cycle, and if americans don't break it before the west dies like every country should, china is just going to blow up into america 2 and a new phase of empires will start and destroy the planet further.
The whole world needs to stop population growth and stop GDP growth. Unfortunately such a fiat-stagnant economy can only function with the complete destruction of fractional reserve banking and the murder of everyone who would try to defend it.
> the complete destruction of fractional reserve banking and the murder of everyone who would try to defend it.
Antisemitism like this should be a crime. The first amendment does NOT protect your right to spread hate!
What if you believe the climate is changing just a little bit due to human action but you don't completely deny it? It's not like the only options are either the end of the world or absolutely nothing.
The absolute hubris of man to believe they can control the weather, lmao
Climate change is superstitious nonesense. These people actuallybbelieve eating bugs will make snow.
>do what I say because the people I paid to agree with me agree with me
Nah.
Provide a realistic solution for china producing 60% of pollution, implement it successfully, and then get back to me. No amount of "green" solutions in any number of Western countries will make any appreciable difference until that is resolved.
when i open my window the climate changes in my apartment, so its real
>deny climate change
because its not caused by the goyim plebs, its caused by israelites with geoengineering (HAARP + chemtrails), also they do not talk about ever increasing populations in africa, india and china (light pollution has increased a lot in these as well)
You're an idiot.
Obsessing about it either way is assinine
Literally what are you gonna do about it?
Maybe if you stopped telling huge bombastic extrapolations, doomsdays that never come, and repeating oil industry propaganda... then using those lies to sell policies that only punish the working class for living instead of holding the powerful accountable, you'd get more traction? Like, have you tried not lying so much?
Climate change isn't about science, it's about politics.
>mfw the people who care about the environment dont understand it at all
The planet is always changing and nothing stays the same. If we have to stop climate change then we also have to stop erosion, desertification, ecological succession, volcanic activity, and the tectonic plates.
The climate has been changing for billions of years, you can't stop it any more than you can stop the tectonic plates from moving. Humans adapted to the Ice Age, we'll adapt to the Heat Age.
We're talking about anthropogenic climate change. You can stop playing semantics now, children.
>anthropogenic
Minimal if any. It's human exceptionalism to think we can change the climate.
>It's human exceptionalism to think we can change the climate.
Do you believe the same is true of destroying, or creating entire ecosystems? Is it hubris to think we're capable of that too? Is terraforming an impossible goal? Please, tell me what reality your feelings have created, I'm curious.
climate change is real, and even though it's a natural cycle humans are clearly significantly accelerating it to the point of derailing it and its in our best interest to slow or halt it no matter who is to blame
but climate change is not so important that everyone who has a decent life needs to give up anything but reproduction and work. the majority of emissions come from power generation, transportation, and industry. eating meat, having pets, etc are insignificant. food production can just be moved closer to cities, and populations in the west and far east are naturally shrinking to sustainable levels anyways. car emissions are somewhat significant but could be made insignificant by aggressively reducing car dependence in major population centers which would also increase freedom by improving freedom of movement. auto travel is strictly nonfree due to all the licenses, regulations, and strongly enforced routing. america is about freedom, right? then you should be allowed to own a car and use it however you want on private property but you shouldn't have to use it because the limited access roadway systems requires you drive 1 hour to work when it would take 45 minutes to walk, if it were legal.
>not being allowed to walk somewhere
kek
if anyone cared about climate change, 100% of coal plants would have been shut down yesterday, zoning laws would have been altered to encourage bringing farming and jobs closer to where people live, air travel would have been shuttered and replaced with high speed rail by central planners, and outsourcing production to other countries would be heavily penalized. there would be a massive push to lower the birthrate in the third world as well.
instead you are going to voluntarily start eating slop and put down your cat to virtue signal on social media while nothing changes. you will also buy a new tesla every year such that someone running the same honda civic since 2010 has less net emissions and has done less damage to the planet
Are you refusing to use proper capitalization to save on carbon emissions or something?
It's not that I don't believe it's real. It's that I don't want to live in a communist shithole which appears to be the only “solution” to the problem.
>The science is settled!
>Experts agree!
>I have a PhD in oceanography!
>Natural issues that are proveably, objectively true but cannot be solved with conservatism are immediately invalid because I cannot twist it into some pro-conservative dogma.
Ftfy. Get a grip.
You're a moronic lunatic that can only understand issues if they have something to do with culture wars.
I'm not smart enough to figure out climate change. It seems to me that from watching BBC dinosaur docs that the planet will eventually become inhospitable to humans regardless of human cause.
>hey bro how did you form your opinion?
>just watched some BBC dinosaur docs.
What piss me about climate change propaganda is it make people be dismissive of other environmental issue like deforestation and chemical run off population. People just want to pretend that humanity isn't over populating the globe and destroying nature to make space. Not that I'm one of people that believe humanity is virus nonsense, believe we need learn to live within and among nature more.
It's always funny watching biologists try to pretend the valid environmental issues they're complaining about play a serious role in climate change because they know it's the only way they'll get attention.
>1970's
>forestry autists freaking out about acid rain
>nobody cares
>suddenly SO2 will cool the planet and unleash an ice age
>pollution controls instated
>flash forward 30 years, "nobody ever claimed there would be an ice age in the 70's >:("
My whole life people have been telling me we will enter a world ending feedback loop in 10 years unless all but the richest abandon the gains in prosperity our ancestors fought for since we hit rock bottom with the industrial revolution. The same people turn a blind eye to Africa's explosive population growth. In 2100 half of earths population is projected to reach 11 billion, half of which will be African. It seems like common sense that if you want to cut consumption you don't double the number of consumers, but maybe the people in charge have conflicts of interest.
based antinatalists
Nuking India and China would be the best possible thing to do for the health of the planet.
Terminal contrarianism, arrogance, and ignorance.
It's undeniable that human activity affects the planet. All life has an effect on the environment, the very oxygen we depend on for example is a direct result of life processes "changing" the climate.
The part that reasonable people doubt is whether or not this is some doom and gloom apocalyptic scenario that will devastate our world and increase human suffering. The important question is "what are you advocating for?"
Doomsday-cult fear mongering over fossil fuels ignores the vast benefits they provide, especially for energy-poor impoverished populations all over the world who could really use those benefits. Cheap, reliable, easily transportable energy is worth the side effects until better alternatives are actually viable.
>fence sitter-teir take
Consider the gator pit
>nuanced and educated take
>ur a fencesitter!!!!11!1!
This is pure directionbrain. There are only two radicals and any other alternatives are "fencesitting".
No, no, you're just a useless fence sitter.
>"DUUUUHR, we should all just sit here until something that may be better den fossil fules show up.... yeah..... duuuuurrr"
Again, the important issue is what specific policies are being proposed & advocated for. Using apocalyptic messaging and dubious predictions to put even more barriers in place against technology that is proven to increase human well being is silly at best. Most "alternative" energy sources are nowhere near ready to replace the fossil fuel infrastructure we're already using in the US, and more regulations & restrictions against them will ultimately just end up being more costly for the end-user. You can't legislate innovation, no amount of subsidy will magically make solar or wind truly viable.
The only real "alternative" is at this point is nuclear, and good luck trying to get that idea off the ground.
https://mises.org/fueling-freer-future
did you really get tricked by propaganda from a moronic ancap? The first thing that website opens which is saying that natural gas upped the average human life span with no source or reason. The increase of human lifespan is due almost entirely to removing the huge outlier of child births a medical advancement unrelated to fossil fuels, not fricking air conditioning. Do you realize how moronic and immature saying that air conditioning saved the world sounds? If you're going to post a link make sure it doesn't make you look like a fricking moron next time.
>millions no longer die from cold in winter
Pure coincidence.
>food able to be transported from continents away
More coincidences.
>global economy raises standard of living for billions
Perhaps an act of God?
A growing economy and disconnecting people from where their food is made does not lead to more fulfilling or healthy lives, if your idea of making life better for people is shipping bananas across the Atlantic and "A growing economy" I think you should rethink what you value in life. Many communities of people happier than you have existed throughout history(Google potlatch) and could exist without the use of fossil fuels. Your mind is trapped by a system you're incapable of conceiving and you will be drained like a stuck pig for the rest of your pathetic life.
>REEE HOW DARE YOU SHIP BANANAS OVERSEAS
>oh, but all that medication made internationally? teleported via unicorns and rainbows
you're moronic
The fossil fuels are benefitical to poor countries arguement doesnt work. Why are reach countries like the US not heavily investing in these and then marketing the prodicts to poor countries and making tons of money by basically controlling their power supply? or how they get it or the technology behind it. Why should poor countries try to innovate when we, the rich countries, do not lead by example? There are tons of opportunities in investing into alternative fuels that just are not getting done.
We could also significantly cut down on the beef we eat in the US and that would be a dramatic help too, but people are not doing that either. It is not just fossil fuels. There are ways to help, easier ways, that we refuse to do.
How come communists are always the ones loudly screaming that only the rich should be allowed to eat beef?
because poorer countries burn wood, or coal which is super cheap because these places do not have the people or the money to be able to use wind or solar power
The superior African mud hut stays cool without all the hassle
>the rich countries, do not lead by example?
Certainly you aren't proposing the lie of solar and wind which are just as finite as anything else and just as damaging in their own way except way shittier
We've been trying to advocate for nuclear for decades which is the only way forward, that's it, nothing else. There are zero legitimate alternatives and yet the supposed environmentalists fight against it with everything they have
>cut down on the beef we eat
I would sooner stomp every endangered species on earth to death myself than allow someone to control how I nourish my body
**all uncomfy threads which may be tangential to animals and nature should go on science**
>all uncomfy threads