We took wolves, one of the most attractive animals in nature, and turned them into drooling abominations with soulless black voids for eyes.
Why did we do it? Were our ancestors ashamed that they felt attracted to their dogs, so bred them to be unappealing?
>inb4 b-but muh huskeroni!!
Yes, some spitzes and collies do retain some of the attractiveness of wolves.
Just to make you upset. Thousands of years, targeted at specifically making you, OP, upset. Seethe.
You own a woflcock dildo and a flithy unwashed fursuit don't you? unironcially remove yourself from the census.
Jannies, delete this zoophile homosexual's thread
seething
Please, I impore you, go seduce a wolf in the wild, even better, try to join a pack, try to submit and become a true beta or omega. Please please do.
If I only could, I surely would...
You're not me, schizo.
But yeah, I would too
Are you one of those fags who claim ''zoophiles ruin this board'' while you go out of your way to see zoophilia in everything
>collies do retain some of the attractiveness of wolves
collie rapist thread. they're not even close.
collies are extremely doglike with close set, round, beady eyes, pushed in faces, short stubby legs, and big floppy ears. you just said that because huskies and collies are the first and second most popular dogs in furry porn. most siberian huskies aren't even that wolfy either, they're just more wolfy than a collie.
Big cats > wild dogs > cats > dogs on average tbh
reminder that dogs were bred to be servants, not pets.
cats were bred to be pets. there's a difference.
i love my fluffy servant girl more than a toxo
Shes beauty shes grace.
Looks kinda like mine
cute husky
Humans are ugly and degenerate so they wanted their pets the same way.
>people consider this "cute"
>people preferring picrel over a normal dog
Schizophrenic narcissists.
The actual 1 to 1 comparison is this, where it's clearly a submissive semi-fearful grimace and they aren't deformed so it looks like something it isn't (a smile).
Dogs are uncanny and creepy. An animal should not look happy if it's actually afraid of you.
Awooooofuck
There is nothing schizophrenic or narcissistic about not liking animals that have been selectively deformed to look like human infants at all times. I'm not a woman. I don't have any maternal instinct to speak of. And when it's triggered for fatherly reasons, I want it to be for children I fathered, not an animal that is, by every definition, a brood parasite that steals my resources by looking vaguely like a child.
No, you're schizophrenic narcissists because you want to be speshul by preferring wolves over dogs. You can justify it any way you want, but the long and short of it is dogs are just better pets in literally every conceivable way. It's just a fact. The only way someone would want a wolf or a wolfdog as a pet is if they're so deeply narcissistic they think they're special enough to raise one, and they're schizophrenic enough to think that's normal.
The entire point of dogs is to be appealing to bumans, otherwise they wouldnt have been domesticated. If you don't find them appealing then there is simply something wrong with you, and that makes you broken, not special.
Projection. I work from home and live in the sticks. I dont need or want a better slave.
>appealing to humans
Appealing to women. Slaves to men. They look like infants. I’m a childless man so I have no maternal urges. You know what men traditionally did with dogs? Beat them if they didn’t listen. Appealing, sure.
>muh man and woman so different
More narcissism. Your brain isn't different than a womans. You just don't like dogs because you don't like dogs, not because you're an xtra speshul alfa male.
>confidence is narcissistic
>deviation from the norm is schizophrenia
Who knew. The people of brave new world built time machines. This nigga is so insane he’d call you deformed and retarded if you didn’t like cheddar chease
>it was created to be tasty to humans or it wouldn’t exist, so you aren’t human!
nagger. A lot of people today absolutely hate dogs and the #1 reason is they’re unnerving and pathetic. All the breeding to make them look and act human ish hits the uncanny valley. Wolves basically look like weird cats and appeal to cat people. Being a dogfag is not THE human condition. Do you know whats narcissistic? Thinking your tastes are THE human condition.
If you dislike canines I don't give a shit. You're a narcissist if you prefer wolves over dogs as pets or potential pets, as I already said.
You don’t seem to know what narcissism is but your need to establish superiority in every interaction and entirely negative, hateful personality is definitely its own disorder.
Your argument rests on the equivalent statement to “white bread was made from whole wheat to be appealing, so if you prefer whole wheat you are a snowflake narcissistic tryhard homosexual”. What even makes a good pet? For who? Im not a neolithic villager or subsistence hunter. Yes I am special, everyone is special. If you are black you are different from a white person. Men are different from women. Children, teens, adults, and geezers are different. Acknowledging that doesn’t make you anything. And clearly you are a sheltered shit who cant handle dissenting opinions so I suspect being whatever you are makes you special. Just not in a good way. I don’t like dogs. They aren’t good pets. They’re disgusting and obnoxious working animals. Dogs are livestock that aren’t capable of loving you. Wolves are independent animals and I consider the process of genuinely befriending one a desirable experience. If your idea of a pet is a slave that sits idle while you finish your shift at starbucks and you hate wolves because they can’t fit your lifestyle I dont care. Your opinions are not defining of humanity. My situation is materially different than yours. My feelings are different from yours. Everyone is different. Deal with it pal. Sorry you feel threatened when someone is creeped out instead of swooning when an animal expressing fear and nervousness looks like a grinning baby and start playing freud.
Tldr. Sounds like a whole lotta cope though.
Ha, that's a lot like my little brother's clinically narcissistic ex-fiance's old catchphrase. "Okay, I wasn't listening, but you sound like you need therapy". The reason she was his EX fiance is because we're both into old sportscars and classic sportbikes, and she started bringing up something like this more and more
>Uh new cars were made to be better. What makes you so special?
>If you like this there's something wrong with your head, you're stupid.
>Do you want to stand out?
>You aren't better than anyone else because you want to fix things yourself. Going to a mechanic is just better.
>me and my brother: We are at a rallycross track.
I have no idea why he got engaged to her after 2 months.
Weird pets like wolves are the same as other inaccessible hobbies. They aren't for everyone but they are very rewarding because of the difficulty involved and the more rural, open air life that necessarily comes with it. They were developed for and by people who worked hard to get their families somewhere with more open space and more free time and cash.
That doesn't mean there's something wrong with someone that has 10 fenced in acres and 30 hour at-home work weeks getting a wolf. I would only start questioning someone's sanity if they got a full blooded wolf in the middle of a suburb or god forbid a city. But if you have the space and time they are genuinely good companions, not just shit eating yes men. And the prospects for them if you suddenly die or lose everything in a fire are better. Dogs go to karen rescues and kill shelters that place them with a lying couple that will take them home and beat and neglect them. Wolves go to sanctuaries that want to keep them in perfect health living in well manicured simulated woods with a bunch of other wolves and charge people to see them for 20 seconds.
Brevity is the heart of wit.
I'm not trying to be witty.
I'm engaging with a whiny bitch in a way he can understand.
Whiny bitches tend to write entire thesis explaining why they're right and you're wrong etc.
Or whatever is in your novellas. Idk. I haven't read them.
Agreed with you mostly but having one wolf would require you to have another to keep him company. I don't think pure wolves would be very happy in captivity/living by your schedule, even if you did WFH and had lots of space and time for them.
>Wolves go to sanctuaries that want to keep them in perfect health living in well manicured simulated woods with a bunch of other wolves
All of these sanctuaries are completely filled unfortunately. People in over their head get a wolf or wolfdog and then since the sanctuaries can't take them in once they're older and harder to take care of they get euthanized.
You can have just one wolf but the relationship is necessarily much closer than most people are okay with. There's really only one possible relationship in a wolf's brain when there's only two of you and it makes them very demanding and clingy.
That would be fine with me if we were very close with each other—but it’s hard to fit that into the modern world as it is. Your wolf friend won’t understand why you left him alone for a few hours to run an errand and it will cause him distress being separated from his most important person like that
>wolffags are just catfags on copium
makes sense
Idk but they are the stencil for the human "race"
look up domestication syndrome
>>he saged the thread hoping I wouldn't notice his reply
kek i always love when that happens. that's how you know you got to them
meant to reply to
imagine being such a conversationlet that you get saged enough to develop a confirmation bias about it
nah saging the thread when losing an argument is a classic cope
if you consider "losing an argument" becoming bored by strawmen, ad hominem, and low effort circular logic,
sure
impressive number of le epic debater buzzwords in one sentence
exactly
Go outside nigga Jesus Christ
>touch grass lmao
>lol u saged
>that means win
I'm not that guy. Just pointing out that anyone who has ever used the word "strawmen" needs to touch grass immediately
why?
because you frequently get called one because you have no argument and this upsets you?
what? you don't call someone a "stawman" as an insult, retard
you actually have no clue what the words you use even mean lmao
just stop posting, lad
>stawman
>the rest of your post
stop drinking bro
Its more like
>wolf = cro magnon
>husky = ancestral indo-european
>nordic spitz breeds = the people that keep them
>collie = scandinavian descendant living on the british isles, has all his loicenses in order at any given time and knows all the laws
>daschund = modern german
>pitbull = average londoner
>mastiff = hails from manchester
>corgi = welshman denied his favorite activity due to insufficient height
>this dog = american displaying prehistoric features due to a mixture of native american (siberian migrant) and nordic blood
because if you breed something to BE stupid and docile it will also LOOK stupid and docile. incapable of thought. all it does is what you conditioned it to. why would a literal retard look like a healthy person? the face and brain develop from the same fetal tissue.
domestication in humans is considered a genetic disorder.
>collies do retain some of the attractiveness
fucking lmao
huskies don't even get very close but other dogs make them look wolf like by comparison.
now kiss homosexuals
Can you guys at least post wolf/yote photos in your arguments?
Wrong thread
Retards want living teddy bears. So they bred them to look that way
OP here. I think I need to restate my question because you're all irredeemably autistic:
Why is it that THE MAJORITY OF domestic dogs are significantly less attractive than wolves? What was the reason for us breeding MOST OF them to be so drastically mutated from their wild ancestors; why were these visually unappealing traits bred into THE MAJORITY OF dog breeds by human breeders?
n.b. cats are not relevant to this question
Hope this clears things up
because normies have bad taste
Normies generally prefer attractive or cute things over ugly things, right? Why is it not the same for dogs?
I could understand if small dogs were bred to be like small, cute, neotenous wolves, but they're not; they're drooling goblina abominations for the most part.
healthy dogs are too high maintenence for normies
Why couldn't we have bred an attractive, low maintenance dog then?
kys console autists
because looking good requires effort
What? We started with something that looked good and actively made it ugly
exactly
try owning a wolf or a fox
they require a lot of effort compared to an ugly dog that cant breathe and move
For the same reason retards are cute. Normies are like ''hey, look at my cute little retard dog, aren't you dumb and gay and cute''.
This actually might be somewhere close to the truth.
Dog owners (normie ones, before you all start seething) tend to see their pets as completely beneath them. Simply a mindbroken but loveable slave with no kind of agency. They do not respect these animals at all.
That becomes a lot easier when you breed it to look like a goofy retard with soulless beady eyes, rather than an athletic, sharp-featured, wolf-like dog with piercing blue/amber/green eyes.
This would explain why a lot of husky owners tend to treat their dogs more like "equals" when compared to more mutant dog owners.
But why couldn't we just breed more docile, low-energy attractive dogs?
Do you have statistics for this?
Yes. You can find them here:
https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/trollface
Thought so.
I'm sorry my post made you upset. Are you an owner of a mutant dog by any chance?
>w-where's the peer-reviewed study to back up that opinion?!?!
You might be happier on Reddit, my friend
Nope. I prefer wolves>dogs though
>But why couldn't we just breed more docile, low-energy attractive dogs?
because form follows function
>no actual explanation
try using your brain for once in your pathetic life
You don't know what you're talking about
you communicate like a no iq bot
You have no actual insights and can't explain your opinions so your input is useless
>b-bot!
jej. You communicate like a /misc/ poster
Teddy bears aren't disgusting to look at though
form follows function is an incredibly well established, antique, school of thought on design that any 95 iq midwit should be able to google and understand without infantile spoonfeeding
I'm aware of the concept, I just don't think it's as insightful as you think it is. Let's take the eyes as an example - say I want a docile, friendly, low-energy companion dog, why does it have to end up with beady, soulless eyes?
>95 iq midwit
The midwit meme is meant to mock people with slightly above average intelligence. If you're going to use it, at least get it right.
No, that's not what I mean. Why can't the docile companion breeds retain wolf-like faces (or a "cuter" version of them, anyway)?
Okay, anon
im not meming
im specifically calling you out for being below average iq
Yes, I can see that.
All while being unable to answer the question and looking like a retard in the process. Thanks for your input anon.
>No, that's not what I mean. Why can't the docile companion breeds retain wolf-like faces (or a "cuter" version of them, anyway)?
German spitz breeds exist.
Yeah, they're close. They still have the soulless eyes though.
Also, I find Pomeranian faces unappealing for some reason
>I need an example of a companion dog with a wolf like face
>gives example of an entire family of breeds that are companion dogs but have wolf like faces
>no not those they're unappealing
Ywn be satisfied, why even complain
It's kind of a secondary discussion to the main question really. German spitzes make up a minority of small dogs anyway. They're not as popular as a lot of the deformed breeds, which I will never understand the appeal of.
>you obviously have an answer in your head you want to hear
Well yes, a coherent and well thought-out one would be great
There's no scientific reason why ugly would be bad except within humans.
lmao
im sorry but youre too stupid to have a proper conversation with
You clearly never wanted a conversation in the first place when you kept saying ''just google it, retard''. You can't simultaneously claim that it's extremely simple while not being able to explain it.
My guess is that it's easier make dogs low energy by crippling them than to breed out mental processes. Is that what you were trying to say but couldn't?
i didnt want a conversation with a retard who cant figure out the concepts without being spoonfed, youre correct
Wauf isnt an educational instituation
what was the question?
>what was the question?
Feel free to re-read the thread, anon. Though to be honest, I don't think you'll be able to answer it so I won't bother spoonfeeding you.
im not going to reread the thread
i answered the op question multiple times
you obviously have an answer in your head you want to hear
Imagine going out of your way this much to be unhelpful. Just say nothing if you really can't be bothered.
imagine not googling simple, well documented concepts and instead expecting anon to regurgitate them for nobodies on a siamese lawnmowing forum for absolutely nothing in return
>for absolutely nothing in return
As opposed to this extremely rewarding discussion that makes both of us flourish
being unable to do 1.5 minutes of wikipedia """"research"" officially excludes you from my pool of people i might be able to have a semblance of a rewarding conversation with
at his point im just bullying you for fun
>get btfo and exposed as a pseud
>i-i'm just bullying you, heh
How do you even make a post like this without dying of cringe? This reminds me of a post I would make when I would lose an argument on /b/ as a teenager lmao
you should probably just go back to /b/
Not been there in many years, think it's just coomer shit now.
Anon, a bit of advice for future posting: if you're going to make posts about how high IQ you are, you had better make sure you have the knowledge and intelligence to back it up (or get better at pretending you do), otherwise it's just embarrassing for all involved.
i only ever called you low iq to be fair
True, true. Point still stands though
I did look it up, I don't see how it applies to aesthetic beauty, can't be bothered to look further into it because for all I know you might as well be talking out of your ass.
lel you really thought you looked smart regurgitating design philosophy 101 shit with no regard to the actual context or intelligence to back it up didn't you?
oh boy you finally looked it up 🙂
>calling anon out for regurgitating terms after calling anon out for not regurgiataing terms
stay classy anon
Anon, you're obviously samefagging. The point was that he (i.e. (You)) regurgitated something he had heard before, but could not elaborate any further because he didn't know anything about the thing he regurgitated.
This is why he then resorted to
>you're le dumb so I won't explain myself
Because he literally did not have the knowledge on the subject, or the eloquence to explain his opinions
>le SAMEFAGGING
yawn
Lmao I caught you didn't I.
Proper etiquette is to at least post a photoshopped or inspect element'd image and tell me to take my meds 😉
>he saged the thread hoping I wouldn't notice his reply so I wouldn't BTFO him any more
Mark of a coward, anon.
seems like you problems
my , non self aware , dude
You seem like the argumentative type who will just keep on replying to my posts no matter how many times he gets humiliated (because getting the last reply is the same as winning in your mind), so I give you permission to leave the thread to save yourself further embarrassment.
You may respond to this post with "cope", or "seethe", or however you see fit. Goodnight, anon.
> my coping and seething isn't as noticable if I preempt it
>But why couldn't we just breed more docile, low-energy attractive dogs?
We do, they're called companion breeds.
Oh but do you mean breeds that look like they can work? Because for something to look like it can work, it has to be able to work, and therefore can't be docile or low energy.
You're retarded, and this is obvious.
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. And while I agree that there are lots of dogs that are objectively ugly (pugs, obv) to say every dog that isn't wolf-like is ugly is disingenuous.
Nevertheless I have theories:
>humans are predisposed to find babies cute
>finding something cute makes us want to protect it
>this is an evolutionary quirk so we dont kill our own babies for being annoying
>this translates to other things that have the vague features of human babies
>big foreheads, big heads, and big expressive eyes
>it's why kittens are so cute
>it's why anime is so appealing
>so domestic dogs, even working lines that serve a purpose beyond looking cute, generally follow that trend away from wolves
>of a shorter snout, big expressive eyes, and a bigger forehead
The dark eyes likely became a thing because people didn't like the amber eyes of a wolf staring them down, it's a very predatory stare
>b-but muh attractiveness!!!
I'm not a freak zoophile so I can't speak on that shit. Although I find wolves pretty I don't think I'd ever want one or a dog that looks close to one. I'm not some attention seeking hipster who needs a speshul wolfdog to feel big. I like my regular dogs, like my ancestors intended.
Wow. Good post, ano-
>>it's why anime is so appealing
Never mind
So you’re a pedo and prefer neotenous 12 year olds over real women as well?
t. Wolf and women with jawlines enjoyer
Regarding the shorter snouts, apparently there's a link between the snout length and distribution of retinal ganglion cells
https://www.karger.com/Article/Abstract/73756
According to the above article, dogs with longer snouts have a broader horizontal streak of ganglions, while the vision of dogs with shorter snouts is focused more onto a central point not unlike a human's.
Purely speculating here, but it's possible that dogs with shorter snouts consequently had an advantage in a domesticated role in some way or another:
>easier to read our facial expressions
>easier to distinguish between different faces (very important for a guard dog)
>might be more effective to hunt/fight or otherwise work with humans if we can more easily relate to each other's field of vision
On a tangent, it also perhaps explains why sighthounds tend to have such longer snouts, because the wider streak makes it easier for them to keep track of prey when it makes a turn.
That's really interesting and isnt something I would've ever thought about. Thanks anon!
>attractive
have a nice day. You're far more abominable and unnatural than any dog.
If you have a dog or cat you're basically a normie kek
you just basically admit cats are cuter
Eh, in general, yes. Cats are less "mutant" and tend to resemble their wild ancestors more than most dogs. They're not as attractive as wolves or foxes though
>vacant snake eyes stare
>weird shaped pudgy body that looks like it might explode diarrhea if you poke it with a pointy stick
cats really are not cute at all
not him but i think cats are cuter than dogs and i own both. its the main reason why people own them.
i guess it makes sense because normies have bad taste
>liking normie pets
Wow!
snake eyes stare
Better than a soulless beady-eyed void stare imo
shaped pudgy body that looks like it might explode diarrhea if you poke it with a pointy stick
Only true if overfed. A healthy cat body is lean and athletic
>normies
Come on dude, we're talking about the two most normie animals by far here
yes
the answer to why dogs and cats are ugly is because normies have bad taste
Cats are completely irrelevant to this discussion though. Picrel is what domestic cats came from - it's basically unchanged in overall body shape, just the coloring is different really.
The question is, why did we turn wolves into mutants?
if you think house cats arent mutant retards than youre a mutant retard whose input is irrelevent to this discussion
>Stop liking what I like!!!
kek
>stop comparing apples to apples
retard logic
Look at an african wildcat, then at a domestic cat
Look at a wolf, and then at a pug
One of them is a lot more mutated than the other
I don't even particularly like cats, but it's obvious that they're less physically mutated than dogs
>look at persian munchkin cat then look at an indian pariah dog
>one of them is obviously more mutated than the other
lol I like dogs too but it isn't even close
my point is that it is retarded to cherry pick
all domestic animals quickly revert to a feral pariah state
it's not cherrypicking when more dogs are mutated on average to cats
it is absolutely cherry picking when you compare cats as a whole to toadlines
But the entire point is that we mentioned that dogs on general are more mutated which was stated before that post kek
and my point is that dogs in general arent "more mutated" any more than cats or pigeons are and picking out specific lineages as proof is disingenuous
They pretty much are. there are more mutated dog breeds from their wild counterparts.
breeds literally dont count
without humab intervention a toadline will quickly die out or become a dingo the same way a munchkin will become a tabby
obviously if you start inbreeding animals for exaggerated features thats what youre going to end up with
they do count . they're are all in the same genus. some dogs were bred for specific purpose which made them mutated
and comparing any specific dog breed to cats as a whole is disengenuous for the same reason
>Eh, in general, yes. Cats are less "mutant" and tend to resemble their wild ancestors more than most dogs. They're not as attractive as wolves or foxes though
>in general
excludes specific breeds so the same applies to dogs
every dog and cat specie
>obviously if you start inbreeding animals for exaggerated features thats what youre going to end up with
Yeah and people did that more with dogs than with cats, this is just a fact, what the fuck is your point?
They literally are though. The fact that huskies exist doesn't mean that the majority of dogs are way more mutated than the majority of cats
Even labradors are way more mutated than cats
Reddit
Mutant dogs are the default, mutant cats are a novelty
OP here, please don't turn my thread into ANOTHER console wars autismfest
you brought this on yourself when you decided to become a wolfaboo.
no wolves or yotes for you, but have a baby african wild dog
>licking your ass on the kitchen table is cute
cute cats
Inbreeding, lots and lots of inbreeding
To make them better slaves. All the ugly dogs are highly derived, very submissive and obedient ones that you are genuinely the master to. Their disordered, degraded bodies reflect their disordered, degraded minds.
The more you breed any canine, even a fox, for lower intelligence and higher docility, the more "dog-like" they start to look with floppy ears, droopy unmoving faces, and beady, lifeless eyes.
We took away their ability to express a wide spectrum of emotions because they didn't even have them anymore. We took away their dignity because they didn't have it anymore. The average ugly dog like a pitbull or golden retriever has trouble with expressing any form of agency. Some of them will whine at a partially open door for a human to open it. It's really quite pathetic.
Notice those attractive wolfy dogs are also disobedient and have a tendency to fuck off and do their own thing, to the point of trying to escape one owner in particular and seek out a new one.
Good post. What about collies though? They're submissive but still look attractive
That's the how, not the why
Dogs have more expressive faces than wolves
dogs got selected to be stuck in extended lower developmental stages. wolves are plenty expressive as puppies and then mature to actually fit their size. most people hate giant dogs that still act like retards
both of you are wrong. wolves can actually express much more IF the dog being compared has droopy lips, dark eyes, and totally floppy ears.
something like a husky is just a wolf with eyebrows so it's slightly more expressive.
>We took away their ability to express a wide spectrum of emotions
Domestic dogs have the ability to express many more emotions in their face than wild wolves.