Are Fungi sapient?

Recent studies have shown that Cordyceps don't attack the nervous system but actually strike the muscular tissue of Ants, thereby leaving the mind intact as they take over the body. Meaning Fungi must understand the idea of movement and how an Ant's body functions, not only that they would have to understand their environmental surroundings. How would they know that, if they weren't sapient?

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  1. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    Have you guys seen that general on /x/ where they're claiming the majority of human ailments stem from most of us being infected with a candida fungus? They're doing this whole supplements-and-detox routine and it apparently works, plus the guy who started it is claiming he has a paper in peer review. It's all a load of horseshit, isn't it? I can't find any discussion of it that isn't in their court already.

    [...]

  2. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    they're probably unable to feed on anything besides the muscles

  3. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    Sapient is a far stretch but fungi do communicate and process information, albeit in a form rather slow and alien to our own. Sapience requires, seemingly, a lot of information processing and dedicated structures for handling varying forms of information and categorizing/classifying them(I.E. object permanence). They're sentient though, like many organisms on Earth -- even single-celled ones.

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      >fungi do communicate and process information
      Some trees actually use fungi as messengers to communicate with each other.

      Fine. Give me one another example where an organism from an entirely different kingdom is able to manipulate another organism? Microrganisms don't count.

      >Microrganisms don't count.
      Get fricked. See T. gondii, and

      https://i.imgur.com/6qrppk8.jpg

      > other than parasites and microorganisms
      > also it can only be a plant infecting a mammal
      That seems like the most arbitrary set of rules to defend an "argument" I've seen in this site yet.
      If every microorganism and every parasite doesn't count (so no animals on plants), and anything fungi related would """"prove"""" your point, what DOES count exactly?
      The fungi you posted is both a parasite AND a microorganism and works the same as many other kinds of parasites that use their host to reproduce.
      Besides, Cordyceps doesn't even change its host that much behaviorally, going up is a natural instinct for most insects the fungi is just triggering it, things like castrating parasites change the host a lot, lot more.
      Even so there are STILL plants that adhere to your idiotic requests, those being flowers that actively attach their pollen to pollinizer while imitating possible mates, like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yLnKfhmUzg

      Have you guys seen that general on /x/ where they're claiming the majority of human ailments stem from most of us being infected with a candida fungus? They're doing this whole supplements-and-detox routine and it apparently works, plus the guy who started it is claiming he has a paper in peer review. It's all a load of horseshit, isn't it? I can't find any discussion of it that isn't in their court already.
      [...]

      People are dumb as shit. Don't believe anything on /x/ or even enything on Wauf.org

      Cat ownership isn't a significant predictor for toxoplasmosis. It's only shed for the first two weeks of infection. Most people get it from unwashed vegetables or undercooked meat.
      You personally are more likely to get it from your dog eating a feral kitten turd before you french kiss it, basically.

      Pic related.

  4. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    >Meaning Fungi must understand the idea of movement and how an Ant's body functions
    much like plants strategically plan in which direction they should grow, or sperm carefully plans out its moves

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      Not a different animal's body.

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        Plants, alongside EVERY LIVING ORGANISM THAT HAS AN IMMUNE SYSTEM need to "know" the billions of different microorganisms (and macroorganisms like pests as well) that can make them sick, and how their body works to properly counteract it

        • 1 year ago
          Anonymous

          Fine. Give me one another example where an organism from an entirely different kingdom is able to manipulate another organism? Microrganisms don't count.

          • 1 year ago
            Anonymous

            > other than parasites and microorganisms
            > also it can only be a plant infecting a mammal
            That seems like the most arbitrary set of rules to defend an "argument" I've seen in this site yet.
            If every microorganism and every parasite doesn't count (so no animals on plants), and anything fungi related would """"prove"""" your point, what DOES count exactly?
            The fungi you posted is both a parasite AND a microorganism and works the same as many other kinds of parasites that use their host to reproduce.
            Besides, Cordyceps doesn't even change its host that much behaviorally, going up is a natural instinct for most insects the fungi is just triggering it, things like castrating parasites change the host a lot, lot more.
            Even so there are STILL plants that adhere to your idiotic requests, those being flowers that actively attach their pollen to pollinizer while imitating possible mates, like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yLnKfhmUzg

            • 1 year ago
              Anonymous

              Wow thats actually cooler than the cordyceps

            • 1 year ago
              Anonymous

              Wow thats actually cooler than the cordyceps

              Mimicry through years of evolution is hardly impressive than controlling bodies.

  5. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    The behaviour doesn't require knowing anything in the way that word is typically used. It's a predefined sequence of steps.
    Only needs to be more likely to reproduce if they don't attack the nerves, over generations the behaviour will emerge by natural selection.
    Really I suppose they are just choosing a substrate and trading chemicals with the environment like any other fungus or plant, it's just an unusual substrate.

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      How does something that doesn't have limbs understand how limbs work?

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        Exactly. How does a cloud that looks like an elephant know what an elephant looks like?
        Humans try to impose their own experience of the world onto non-sapient lifeforms that are just obliviously doing what they do.
        No plant says "I'm just gonna grab this little bit of sunlight and this little bit of water and funnel them into this little choloroplast in this one little cell and do a little bit of photosynthesis and make a little bit of sugar".
        Heck, you and me have next to zero understanding about our own bodily processes.
        You and me are only alive because of the bacteria in our guts.
        There are more non-human bacterial cells in our bodies than there are human cells (though the human cells weigh a lot more).
        Your brain is just an unusual artifact of evolution. Try not to think too much.

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        How did humans reproduced before discovering genetics?

        https://i.imgur.com/9MAtpUu.jpg

        Recent studies have shown that Cordyceps don't attack the nervous system but actually strike the muscular tissue of Ants, thereby leaving the mind intact as they take over the body. Meaning Fungi must understand the idea of movement and how an Ant's body functions, not only that they would have to understand their environmental surroundings. How would they know that, if they weren't sapient?

        Checking the study and the muscle they take over is the jaw muscle. It does so the final bite is particularly strong to the point it destroys the muscle. Basically it gives the jaw muscle a massive spasm so the ant will die attached in the right position. The rest is done by modulating normal ant behavior using chemicals in the brain. It doesn't grow in the brain and take over its function, it grows beside the brain and alters its function through chemicals. I guess it just give urges to the ant like the urge to climb up and find some place with a better temperature/moisture. For a human analogy imagine if a human fungus ideal conditions for growth would be up a tree in the woods. If you were infected chances would be you lives near some woods. The fungi wouldn't control your leg and arms muscles individually to make you walk to the woods and climb up a tree, it would make you mentally confused, unable to think clearly, feel the desire to be in the ideal location, maybe you are having a hard time breathing, you need a more moist and clean air but also the need of a breeze and open spaces so you head to the nearest woods, climb a tree and only them the fungi activate your arm muscles giving you a massive spasm making you tight the grip on the tree and locking you in position. Since you are not an ant you feel a terrible pain but there is nothing you can do, you are still conscious but the spasm locked your body in position, then you will die and the fungi will complete its cycle.

        • 1 year ago
          Anonymous

          Not OP, but that's a cool explanation. Your scenario would also make a cool horror movie.
          It's somewhat analagous to Toxoplasma gondii, which doesn't force rodents to take any specific action but it reduces their overall aversion to risk and cat urine, which makes them more likely to be killed and eaten by cats, which are Toxo's main host.
          In this way, Toxo in a mouse or rat gets into a cat, which is where it really needs to be.
          Humans infected by Toxo have been statistically shown to get into more car accidents, which strongly suggests that Toxo has a similar effect on humans.
          >inb4 Toxo-infected cat owners start screeching. Keep your eyes on the fricking road.

          • 1 year ago
            Anonymous

            Cat ownership isn't a significant predictor for toxoplasmosis. It's only shed for the first two weeks of infection. Most people get it from unwashed vegetables or undercooked meat.
            You personally are more likely to get it from your dog eating a feral kitten turd before you french kiss it, basically.

        • 1 year ago
          Anonymous

          /tg/ here, that is a fantastic description, seconding this anon

          https://i.imgur.com/z5VPBtO.jpg

          Not OP, but that's a cool explanation. Your scenario would also make a cool horror movie.
          It's somewhat analagous to Toxoplasma gondii, which doesn't force rodents to take any specific action but it reduces their overall aversion to risk and cat urine, which makes them more likely to be killed and eaten by cats, which are Toxo's main host.
          In this way, Toxo in a mouse or rat gets into a cat, which is where it really needs to be.
          Humans infected by Toxo have been statistically shown to get into more car accidents, which strongly suggests that Toxo has a similar effect on humans.
          >inb4 Toxo-infected cat owners start screeching. Keep your eyes on the fricking road.

          I'll somehow homebrew this into my ongoing campaign

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        You're absolutely moronic

        • 1 year ago
          Anonymous

          Explain, then?

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      https://i.imgur.com/nFyapnL.jpg

      Exactly. How does a cloud that looks like an elephant know what an elephant looks like?
      Humans try to impose their own experience of the world onto non-sapient lifeforms that are just obliviously doing what they do.
      No plant says "I'm just gonna grab this little bit of sunlight and this little bit of water and funnel them into this little choloroplast in this one little cell and do a little bit of photosynthesis and make a little bit of sugar".
      Heck, you and me have next to zero understanding about our own bodily processes.
      You and me are only alive because of the bacteria in our guts.
      There are more non-human bacterial cells in our bodies than there are human cells (though the human cells weigh a lot more).
      Your brain is just an unusual artifact of evolution. Try not to think too much.

      How did humans reproduced before discovering genetics?
      [...]
      Checking the study and the muscle they take over is the jaw muscle. It does so the final bite is particularly strong to the point it destroys the muscle. Basically it gives the jaw muscle a massive spasm so the ant will die attached in the right position. The rest is done by modulating normal ant behavior using chemicals in the brain. It doesn't grow in the brain and take over its function, it grows beside the brain and alters its function through chemicals. I guess it just give urges to the ant like the urge to climb up and find some place with a better temperature/moisture. For a human analogy imagine if a human fungus ideal conditions for growth would be up a tree in the woods. If you were infected chances would be you lives near some woods. The fungi wouldn't control your leg and arms muscles individually to make you walk to the woods and climb up a tree, it would make you mentally confused, unable to think clearly, feel the desire to be in the ideal location, maybe you are having a hard time breathing, you need a more moist and clean air but also the need of a breeze and open spaces so you head to the nearest woods, climb a tree and only them the fungi activate your arm muscles giving you a massive spasm making you tight the grip on the tree and locking you in position. Since you are not an ant you feel a terrible pain but there is nothing you can do, you are still conscious but the spasm locked your body in position, then you will die and the fungi will complete its cycle.

      The Ants all end up at a specific height of 26 cm above ground. How can this be made possible if it is just genetic memory?

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        Not all, mostly. The ant is seeking a place with the conditions favored by the fungus. The fungus don’t have eyes nor it receives input from the ant eyes. It probably refrain from infecting the nervous system because it needs the nervous system to keep functioning, it just modulates how the nervous system works so the ant will seek an ideal location using its own nervous system and bypass it in the final moment so the ant will be locked in place.

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        >The Ants all end up at a specific height of 26 cm above ground
        Ants move at X cm/sec
        Fungus can get them to move upward for Y seconds before the chemicals immobilize the ant
        Ant ends up at 26 cm off the ground

        • 1 year ago
          Anonymous

          That might actually make sense. Brilliant.

          • 1 year ago
            Anonymous

            I actually watched a video last night that said the fungus looks for specific light/humidity levels.

            • 1 year ago
              Anonymous

              As explained in the first reply to that post

              [...]
              [...]
              The Ants all end up at a specific height of 26 cm above ground. How can this be made possible if it is just genetic memory?

              >The ant is seeking a place with the conditions favored by the fungus.

  6. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    Something I always thought was weird is that fungi are much closer to being considered animals than as plants.

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      Animals are just overly evolved spores. We were never meant to progress beyond sponges.

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        >there's no going back

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        le orc

  7. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    How do my nails know in which direction to grow?

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      They don't. Everything depends on the nail bed, that is why sometimes they grow into the skin sideways, causing problems.

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        If I carved out the nail bed from someone's finger's, would they just stop growing fingernails entirely?
        Purely hypothetical of course.

        • 1 year ago
          Anonymous

          yes

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